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Ex Works



 
 
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old November 30th 03, 10:52 PM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Alan Wakes
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Posts: 3
Default Ex Works

I have a 2001 Auto-Trail cheyenne 635 on a Fiat Base and the owners hand
book states an ex works weight of 2830 kg.Can anyone tell me what is
included in this weight .
Thanks Alan


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  #2 (permalink)  
Old December 1st 03, 11:15 AM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
David Miller
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Posts: 19
Default Ex Works

"Alan Wakes" wrote in message ...
I have a 2001 Auto-Trail cheyenne 635 on a Fiat Base and the owners hand
book states an ex works weight of 2830 kg.Can anyone tell me what is
included in this weight .
Thanks Alan


Alan

A bit obvious.... but have you tried asking Autotrail?

Dave
  #3 (permalink)  
Old December 1st 03, 08:11 PM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Bob Douglas
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Posts: 275
Default Ex Works

"Alan Wakes" wrote in message
...
I have a 2001 Auto-Trail cheyenne 635 on a Fiat Base and the owners hand
book states an ex works weight of 2830 kg.Can anyone tell me what is
included in this weight .
Thanks Alan


Alan

I assume you are pursuing the perpetually worrying topic of 'payload'. (if
the MAM (GVW) of your vehicle is 3400kg, then the payload might appear to be
570kg, but read on!).

If you are, the previous suggestion of contacting Autotrail is sensible, but
may only give you part of the answer you are chasing.

From experience in deciding on my own requirements (and ultimately ensuring
I bought a vehicle based on the Fiat Maxi chassis, and having it upgraded to
3850kg MAM), I can add the following (not definitive) view.

Practice amongst UK manufacturers has generally been to quote ex-works
weights which include the same items that would be quoted by the base
vehicle manufacturer (generally tools such as jack, 90% fuel load and 75kg
allowance for the driver).

In general, however, no allowance is made for any non-fixed item, or any
absolutely non-standard accessory, relevant to the attached caravan
bodywork. Hence weight is generally with no gas bottles, fresh and waste
tanks dry, no allowance for awnings, bike racks etc.

A number of manufacturers also quote a weight for 'essential habitation
equipment which appears to equate to a full tank of fresh water and full
complement of gas, but this is generally not included in the ex-works
weight. (it may well be in the order of 130-150kg - but I never travel with
anything but a minimum water load.)

In addition, manufacturers may also cover themselves by publishing a
tolerance on manufactured weight, which may be plus or minus 5% (or even
10%)

By the time all these items at their highest have been added together, you
may well have eaten up at least half of the perceived payload!

Then its time to worry about the distribution between front and rear axle. A
recent letter in MMM revealed an absolute minimum load in a large uk built
coachbuilt combined with a driver and passenger pushed the front axle load
over the limit, and left hardly any margin on MAM (GVW).

The only true way to understand where you are is to load up as normal, and
visit a weighbridge to determine the overall weight and that on each axle.

In my opinion, manufacturers throughout Europe are selling motorcaravans
which are barely on the edge of usability due to weight requirements, and
(unless they wanted to be severely restricted in use) I would counsel anyone
buying anything but a coachbuilt vehicle to strongly consider a minimum of
3850kg MAM. (subject to being licensed to drive it!)

The ability to upgrade the chassis is becoming progressively more common,
but why can't manufacturers do it as standard? (I know...it's a marketing
ploy to keep the perceived price down).

For what it is worth (and I don't necessarily subscribe to the Hymer
mythology....especially as their UK importer still insists on generally
importing the lowest graded chassis as standard) some continental
manufacturers (such as Hymer) do quote ex-works weights with the equivalent
of the 'essential habitation equipment' included, which is much more useful
if you know that they are.

Nonetheless, I haven't seen a manufacturer yet that provides the actual axle
weights (which would give a better view of real usability, though ProMobil
in Germany quotes these for vehicles it tests. (Come on MMM)

Bob
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old December 1st 03, 10:31 PM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Niall
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Posts: 15
Default Ex Works

On Mon, 1 Dec 2003 20:11:52 -0000, "Bob Douglas"
wrote:


Then its time to worry about the distribution between front and rear axle. A
recent letter in MMM revealed an absolute minimum load in a large uk built
coachbuilt combined with a driver and passenger pushed the front axle load
over the limit, and left hardly any margin on MAM (GVW).

The only true way to understand where you are is to load up as normal, and
visit a weighbridge to determine the overall weight and that on each axle.

In my opinion, manufacturers throughout Europe are selling motorcaravans
which are barely on the edge of usability due to weight requirements, and
(unless they wanted to be severely restricted in use) I would counsel anyone
buying anything but a coachbuilt vehicle to strongly consider a minimum of
3850kg MAM. (subject to being licensed to drive it!)

The ability to upgrade the chassis is becoming progressively more common,
but why can't manufacturers do it as standard? (I know...it's a marketing
ploy to keep the perceived price down).


Fair enough, bearing in mind that new driving licences are limited to
3500 Kg, but what I can't figure out is where all the weight comes
from. Basic 3500 Kg vans have a payload of around 1600 Kg, that's 1.6
*tonnes*. What on earth are they building motorcaravans out of these
days?

--
Niall

  #5 (permalink)  
Old December 2nd 03, 07:35 PM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Bob Douglas
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Posts: 275
Default Ex Works

"Niall" wrote in message
...
snip
Fair enough, bearing in mind that new driving licences are limited to
3500 Kg, but what I can't figure out is where all the weight comes
from. Basic 3500 Kg vans have a payload of around 1600 Kg, that's 1.6
*tonnes*. What on earth are they building motorcaravans out of these
days?

--
Niall

Materials, and particularly contents, are becoming heavier.

Bigger water tanks, heavier appliances, extra batteries, strengthened seats
and all the belt apparatus, the odd solar panel or two......

More importantly, legislation is leading to manufacturers being more careful
about the weights they quote, and the buying public is becoming more aware.

I'd be interested to check the real available payload on some of the older
vans.

The quoted ex-works weight of my van (sold as standard as 3500kg GVW) is
2900kg, but comparing this with other manufacturer's quoted weights I'd be
interested to check that on a weighbridge, and I suspect it is a 'bare'
weight. (I'll get round to it one day)

Being intrigued, I did a bit of a trawl on the web, and most UK
manufacturers I checked are still very unclear over their quoted weights
(Autotrail, where this thread started, don't even quote anything but GVW
(MAM)).

What was interesting, however, is that Swift have gone for European type
approval, and are clear about their weights, which (starting this year I
imply) include water and gas at the levels quoted on the site much as I
highlighted earlier fro Hymer. Interesting then that some payloads on the
base chassis are now in the 300kg range (not far off 3 adults of my
weight) - not good if you've a family. At least it does help to concentrate
your mind, and upgrades are available.

In my opinion, however, many manufacturers are sailing close to the wind, it
being questionable whether some vehicles could be considered 'fit for
pupose' if sold as more than a two berth.

I've always been aware of payload, and in the past paid for an Autosleeper
to be built on an uprated van because I wanted to carry bikes.

Bob
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old December 7th 03, 06:47 PM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Nomad
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Posts: 31
Default Ex Works


"Alan Wakes" wrote
I have a 2001 Auto-Trail cheyenne 635 on a Fiat Base and the owners hand
book states an ex works weight of 2830 kg.Can anyone tell me what is
included in this weight .
Thanks Alan


Alan


90 percent fuel load and an allowance for the driver of 75Kgms. The payload
is 570Kgms and I assume a passenger, batteries and gas bottles, plus any
water, waste, extras, will be part of this.

Nomad


 



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