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UK Motor Caravans (uk.rec.motorcaravans)

UK Driving Licence



 
 
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old May 2nd 04, 10:26 PM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Geoff
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Posts: 65
Default UK Driving Licence

I sent off my renewal for paper to plastic licence early in February and at
the same time saw that I needed to notify a medical condition which I did.
This means that you positively have to request for the licence to cover a)
minibus and b) commercial vehicles between 3500 and 7500 kg, which I did.
Although there has been a strike, and alleged computer reorganisation at
DVLA, and my medical people failed to tick a box and I am still waiting.

I ticked a) because I may purchase a minibus for conversion if the right one
comes up, (I'm actually thinking initially of an overnight vehicle with food
area and toilet, and perhaps a single bed/settee) and
b) because I once drove a motorcaravan which was nearly 3500kg, but I think
I might have made a mistake in both cases.....

A minibus with most seats taken out...is it still a minibus?
A motorcaravan....is it a commercial vehicle?

Thanks
Geoff


Ads
  #2 (permalink)  
Old May 4th 04, 09:06 AM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
riccip
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Posts: 106
Default UK Driving Licence

"Geoff" wrote:

Perhaps you are worrying unnecessarily here. Unless you intend to
use a minibus "for hire or reward" you don't need a D1driving
licence to drive it. D1 only applies where fee-paying passengers
are involved, which is fair enough really.

I ticked a) because I may purchase a minibus for conversion if the right one
comes up, (I'm actually thinking initially of an overnight vehicle with food
area and toilet, and perhaps a single bed/settee)


I'd strongly recommend you buy an ready-converted motorcaravan
from the start. Minibuses hold their price so you won't be saving
anything, in fact it will probably cost considerably more after
meeting the costs of even a basic self-build project. Also the
minibus will have been around the clock a couple of times. Anyway
minibuses aren't necessarily the ideal base vehicle for a
motorcaravan - too many windows.

A minibus with most seats taken out...is it still a minibus?


Depends on what's on your registration document. Strictly
speaking a minibus is defined as having 9 or more fixed passenger
seats. If you remove some or all of the seats it technically
becomes either a commercial van or an MPV-type private vehicle.
But unless you apply for the registration info to be changed it
will remain a minibus even without seats.

A motorcaravan....is it a commercial vehicle?


As above. For DVLA purposes it becomes a motorcaravan when they
update the vehicle's details to say so. However your insurance
company will require more evidence that a "proper" conversion has
been completed (see the recent thread in this newsgroup - "What
constitutes a motorcaravan?").

A lot of motorcaravans on the road are legally regarded as such
even by their insurance companies but have never had their
registration details updated.

riccip
  #3 (permalink)  
Old May 4th 04, 01:48 PM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
AC
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 83
Default UK Driving Licence

In article , riccip
writes
A minibus with most seats taken out...is it still a minibus?


Insulation of the windows and also the metal structure is a big problem
for either v hot or cold weather.
--
AC
  #4 (permalink)  
Old May 4th 04, 06:57 PM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Bob Douglas
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 275
Default UK Driving Licence


"Geoff" wrote in message
...
I sent off my renewal for paper to plastic licence early in February and

at
the same time saw that I needed to notify a medical condition which I did.
This means that you positively have to request for the licence to cover a)
minibus and b) commercial vehicles between 3500 and 7500 kg, which I did.
Although there has been a strike, and alleged computer reorganisation at
DVLA, and my medical people failed to tick a box and I am still waiting.

I ticked a) because I may purchase a minibus for conversion if the right

one
comes up, (I'm actually thinking initially of an overnight vehicle with

food
area and toilet, and perhaps a single bed/settee) and
b) because I once drove a motorcaravan which was nearly 3500kg, but I

think
I might have made a mistake in both cases.....

A minibus with most seats taken out...is it still a minibus?
A motorcaravan....is it a commercial vehicle?

Thanks
Geoff


A motorcaravan is normally registered as such on the v5, and is not as such
a commercial vehicle. There are still licence restrictions, however.

As far as a driving licence is concerned, limitations apply above 3500kg (a
motorcaravan above this weight being taxed as private heavy goods), and
anyone passing their driving test after 1997 would have to take a
supplementary test to drive these.

In addition, health problems (such as diabetes) are likely to disqualify
from this weight (not sure about age).

Bob

--
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Antispam measures in force - remove nobumf from address to reply
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old May 4th 04, 11:46 PM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Geoff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 65
Default UK Driving Licence

Thanks all for your advice

Geoff


  #6 (permalink)  
Old May 5th 04, 12:12 AM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
gARY
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10
Default UK Driving Licence

LaughOL!!

U lost the plot AC?
gARY
--
Affordable Wheeling:-
http://www.justservices.com/9ukp.html

"AC" wrote
In article , riccip
writes
A minibus with most seats taken out...is it still a minibus?


Insulation of the windows and also the metal structure is a big problem
for either v hot or cold weather.
--
AC




  #7 (permalink)  
Old May 5th 04, 08:46 AM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Geoff Lane
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 870
Default UK Driving Licence

Tone wrote in news:[email protected]
4ax.com:

A minibus with most seats taken out...is it still a minibus?

No its a Van

---
A minibus is defined as a vehicle constructed or adapted to carry more
than 8 but no more than 16 passengers. So, a minibus with most of the
seats taken out is still a minibus because it was constructed to carry
more than 8 passengers (even though it no longer has the seats). That
said, you can "rebuild" the vehicle by removing seats, doing a motorhome
conversion, etc. and then notify DVLA of the change in body type. At that
point, it ceases to be a minibus and becomes whatever you've converted it
to.


A motorcaravan....is it a commercial vehicle?

No its a Motorcaravan

---
It's whatever is stated on the body type entry on the V5. If you've
converted a panel van to a motorcaravan, it's still a panel van until
you've informed DVLA of the change.

Note that in all cases, DVLA may ask you to submit the modified vehicle
to a VOSA station before allowing the change.

--
Geoff Lane
Cornwall, UK
  #8 (permalink)  
Old May 5th 04, 10:18 AM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Tone
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 97
Default UK Driving Licence

On Wed, 05 May 2004 08:46:01 GMT, Geoff Lane
wrote:

Tone wrote in news:[email protected]
4ax.com:

A minibus with most seats taken out...is it still a minibus?

No its a Van

---
A minibus is defined as a vehicle constructed or adapted to carry more
than 8 but no more than 16 passengers. So, a minibus with most of the
seats taken out is still a minibus because it was constructed to carry
more than 8 passengers (even though it no longer has the seats).

Nope dont agree
A minibus without seats is a van


That
said, you can "rebuild" the vehicle by removing seats, doing a motorhome
conversion, etc. and then notify DVLA of the change in body type. At that
point, it ceases to be a minibus and becomes whatever you've converted it
to.


A motorcaravan....is it a commercial vehicle?

No its a Motorcaravan

---
It's whatever is stated on the body type entry on the V5. If you've
converted a panel van to a motorcaravan, it's still a panel van until
you've informed DVLA of the change.


Therefore a Motorcaravan is a Motorcaravan. Not a commercial vehicle

  #9 (permalink)  
Old May 5th 04, 11:14 AM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Andy R
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 821
Default UK Driving Licence


"Tone" wrote in message
s.com...
On Wed, 05 May 2004 08:46:01 GMT, Geoff Lane
wrote:

Tone wrote in news:[email protected]
4ax.com:

A minibus with most seats taken out...is it still a minibus?
No its a Van

---
A minibus is defined as a vehicle constructed or adapted to carry more
than 8 but no more than 16 passengers. So, a minibus with most of the
seats taken out is still a minibus because it was constructed to carry
more than 8 passengers (even though it no longer has the seats).

Nope dont agree
A minibus without seats is a van

This area gets really grey and different agencies see things differently.
When I was involved in LGV driver training there was a company that used a
coach for students to take their category D (PSV) test and catgory C (HGV)
test. They'd cut a big doorway in the back of the vehicle and mounted all
the seats on removeable plates so when they needed it for a coach test it's
have the seats in it and when it was needed for a HGV test it wouldn't.
I've seen the same student drive the same vehicle on the same day with the
same examiner and pass two tests, coach & HGV.

Rgds

Andy R


  #10 (permalink)  
Old May 5th 04, 03:49 PM posted to uk.rec.motorcaravans
Geoff Lane
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 870
Default UK Driving Licence

Tone wrote in news:76f1b85254e99d2110cf3c74d3413939
@news.teranews.com:

A minibus is defined as a vehicle constructed or adapted to carry more
than 8 but no more than 16 passengers. So, a minibus with most of the
seats taken out is still a minibus because it was constructed to carry
more than 8 passengers (even though it no longer has the seats).

Nope dont agree
A minibus without seats is a van


Transport Act 1985 Section 19(1) defines a "small bus" as a vehicle
constructed or adapted to carry more than 8 but no more than 16
passengers. This is the vehicle type otherwise known as a minibus.

Taking the TA literally, a vehicle is constructed with 9 to 16 passenger
seats is a "small bus" or minibus. You can take out seats but you won't
change its status because it was constructed with the requisite number of
seats and so the first part of the definition applies. Now, if you remove
seats and carry out the procedure to notify DVLA that the vehicle is
rebuilt, it's point of construction changes to the time you notified
DVLA. At that point, the vehicle ceases to be a minibus and becomes
whatever you've rebuilt it to become.

However, it doesn't work the other way around because throwing an extra
eight seats into a panel van adapts the vehicle to carry more than 8
passengers and the second part of the definition applies. So, a panel van
with those extra seats is a minibus no matter what it says on the V5.

That said, a vehicle originally constructed as a panel van, then
converted to a minibus by the addition of seats (but without informing
DVLA) becomes a van again merely by removing the extra seats.

In a similar manner, a bus is defined as a vehicle constructed or adapted
to carry more than 8 passengers. So, Andy's scenario was perfectly legal
provided the vehicle was registered as an HGV. With the seats in, it was
adapted to carry more than 8 passengers and so was a bus. With the seats
out, it was neither constructed nor adapated to carry more than 8
passengers and so was a heavy goods vehicle.

--
Geoff Lane
Cornwall, UK
 



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