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UK Caravanning (uk.rec.caravanning) A forum for the discussion of caravanning undertaken by residents of the United Kingdom, whether in the UK or abroad. It encourages the interchange of views on the merits of models of caravan, makes of tow car, accessories, caravan sites, caravan clubs, and other related topics. The term caravan is to include trailer vans, motor caravans and trailer tents.

calor propane



 
 
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old October 14th 09, 07:47 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
KAW
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 27
Default calor propane

Has anyone had problems with propane. Last Sun am when temp was about +3degC
my propane wouldnt vaporise. Had to go back to the old remedy of pouring hot
water over the cylinder (nearly new Cylinder). I wondered if calor had
refilled some cylinders with the wrong gas,
Give thanks for electric water heating.


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  #2 (permalink)  
Old October 14th 09, 08:30 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Dougal
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 91
Default calor propane

KAW wrote:
Has anyone had problems with propane. Last Sun am when temp was about +3degC
my propane wouldnt vaporise. Had to go back to the old remedy of pouring hot
water over the cylinder (nearly new Cylinder). I wondered if calor had
refilled some cylinders with the wrong gas,
Give thanks for electric water heating.


It's very unlikely that Calor would have made a 'mistake' - different
connections and probably refilled on a line some distance from the
butane cylinders.

Your description does suggest that it's butane not propane - is it
possible that Calor themselves did not refill your cylinder? Where did
you get it?

It's not one of these 'new' regulator set-ups is it? What are the
symptoms when they begin to get gunged up?
  #3 (permalink)  
Old October 18th 09, 02:26 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
KAW
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 27
Default calor propane


"Dougal" wrote in message
. uk...
KAW wrote:
Has anyone had problems with propane. Last Sun am when temp was about
+3degC
my propane wouldnt vaporise. Had to go back to the old remedy of pouring
hot
water over the cylinder (nearly new Cylinder). I wondered if calor had
refilled some cylinders with the wrong gas,
Give thanks for electric water heating.


It's very unlikely that Calor would have made a 'mistake' - different
connections and probably refilled on a line some distance from the butane
cylinders.

Your description does suggest that it's butane not propane - is it
possible that Calor themselves did not refill your cylinder? Where did you
get it?

It's not one of these 'new' regulator set-ups is it? What are the symptoms
when they begin to get gunged up?


I got it from a local caravan dealer. They only do calor. I had wondered
about the regulator - it is one of the new fixed ones - but the caravan was
just back from service where I expect the regulator would have been checked.


  #4 (permalink)  
Old October 18th 09, 05:36 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Dougal
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 91
Default calor propane

KAW wrote:
"Dougal" wrote in message
. uk...
KAW wrote:
Has anyone had problems with propane. Last Sun am when temp was about
+3degC
my propane wouldnt vaporise. Had to go back to the old remedy of pouring
hot
water over the cylinder (nearly new Cylinder). I wondered if calor had
refilled some cylinders with the wrong gas,
Give thanks for electric water heating.


It's very unlikely that Calor would have made a 'mistake' - different
connections and probably refilled on a line some distance from the butane
cylinders.

Your description does suggest that it's butane not propane - is it
possible that Calor themselves did not refill your cylinder? Where did you
get it?

It's not one of these 'new' regulator set-ups is it? What are the symptoms
when they begin to get gunged up?


I got it from a local caravan dealer. They only do Calor.


That's almost a politician's answer! It doesn't get to what I was
tentatively suggesting. The dealer may sell Calor cylinders containing
gas but does he get his filled cylinders from Calor? Is he an official
Calor distributor? Filling cylinders is not rocket science and the
dealer may have found a cheap source of filled Calor cylinders (even
done it himself) over which there is no quality control. That would
breach any contract that he may have with Calor, of course.

I had wondered about the regulator - it is one of the new fixed ones - but
the caravan was just back from service where I expect the regulator
would have been checked.


I think it's more likely that you should follow up this possibility. A
lack of flow of vaporised propane as a result of a gunged up regulator
would, I suspect, have very similar symptoms to a reduced flow at low
temperatures of vaporised butane through a clean system.

I wouldn't 'expect' anything from a service! Unless specifically asked
they are unlikely to check for anything other than leaks: if that.

Try the following for light reading:

http://tinyurl.com/yjx57l3 (CC)

http://www.calor.co.uk/technical-bul...mendations.pdf
(I'm not convinced that having the inlet to the regulator at the top is
a good idea. I'm guessing that there is a recognition of existing
caravan or regulator design features in this recommendation i.e. making
the best of a bad job. The fourth link (Truma) seems to recognise this.)

http://www.nationalcaravan.co.uk/ima...kages_rev1.pdf
The third paragraph contains the information that may lead you to a
diagnosis. With the cylinder valve closed disconnect the inlet hose from
the regulator and look for any signs of oily dampness. It's possible
that if the regulator inlet valve has been affected adversely by the
'oil' that replacement may be required but additional measures should be
applied to prevent a recurrance.

http://tinyurl.com/yjd4atc (Truma)
This suggests a solution.

Another improvement may be to get rid of the rubber lined hose from the
cylinder to the regulator in an attempt to rid yourself of any problems
arising from deterioration of the rubber liner.
http://www.gaslow.co.uk/pages/c_s2_1.htm

  #5 (permalink)  
Old October 18th 09, 08:34 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Dougal
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 91
Default calor propane

Dougal wrote:
KAW wrote:
"Dougal" wrote in message
. uk...
KAW wrote:
Has anyone had problems with propane. Last Sun am when temp was
about +3degC
my propane wouldnt vaporise. Had to go back to the old remedy of
pouring hot
water over the cylinder (nearly new Cylinder). I wondered if calor had
refilled some cylinders with the wrong gas,
Give thanks for electric water heating.


It's very unlikely that Calor would have made a 'mistake' - different
connections and probably refilled on a line some distance from the
butane cylinders.

Your description does suggest that it's butane not propane - is it
possible that Calor themselves did not refill your cylinder? Where
did you get it?

It's not one of these 'new' regulator set-ups is it? What are the
symptoms when they begin to get gunged up?


I got it from a local caravan dealer. They only do Calor.


That's almost a politician's answer! It doesn't get to what I was
tentatively suggesting. The dealer may sell Calor cylinders containing
gas but does he get his filled cylinders from Calor? Is he an official
Calor distributor? Filling cylinders is not rocket science and the
dealer may have found a cheap source of filled Calor cylinders (even
done it himself) over which there is no quality control. That would
breach any contract that he may have with Calor, of course.

I had wondered about the regulator - it is one of the new fixed ones -
but
the caravan was just back from service where I expect the regulator
would have been checked.


I think it's more likely that you should follow up this possibility. A
lack of flow of vaporised propane as a result of a gunged up regulator
would, I suspect, have very similar symptoms to a reduced flow at low
temperatures of vaporised butane through a clean system.

I wouldn't 'expect' anything from a service! Unless specifically asked
they are unlikely to check for anything other than leaks: if that.

Try the following for light reading:

http://tinyurl.com/yjx57l3 (CC)

http://www.calor.co.uk/technical-bul...mendations.pdf

(I'm not convinced that having the inlet to the regulator at the top is
a good idea. I'm guessing that there is a recognition of existing
caravan or regulator design features in this recommendation i.e. making
the best of a bad job. The fourth link (Truma) seems to recognise this.)

http://www.nationalcaravan.co.uk/ima...kages_rev1.pdf

The third paragraph contains the information that may lead you to a
diagnosis. With the cylinder valve closed disconnect the inlet hose from
the regulator and look for any signs of oily dampness. It's possible
that if the regulator inlet valve has been affected adversely by the
'oil' that replacement may be required but additional measures should be
applied to prevent a recurrance.

http://tinyurl.com/yjd4atc (Truma)
This suggests a solution.

Another improvement may be to get rid of the rubber lined hose from the
cylinder to the regulator in an attempt to rid yourself of any problems
arising from deterioration of the rubber liner.
http://www.gaslow.co.uk/pages/c_s2_1.htm


As a follow-up to the last item, quite a lot of work has been done in
Western Australia where a similar problem to that affecting UK caravans
has been seen in automotive LPG installations. There is a fundamental
difference in that the caravan cylinder to regulator hose should be
carrying only gas whilst the hose considered in Western Australia
carries liquid LPG. There's a very nice report detailing the findings:
http://tinyurl.com/yhkzmkm
(I've given the top level link as some of the other documents are also
interesting.)
  #6 (permalink)  
Old October 19th 09, 02:48 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
KAW
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 27
Default calor propane


"Dougal" wrote in message
. uk...
Dougal wrote:
KAW wrote:
"Dougal" wrote in message
. uk...
KAW wrote:
Has anyone had problems with propane. Last Sun am when temp was about
+3degC
my propane wouldnt vaporise. Had to go back to the old remedy of
pouring hot
water over the cylinder (nearly new Cylinder). I wondered if calor had
refilled some cylinders with the wrong gas,
Give thanks for electric water heating.


It's very unlikely that Calor would have made a 'mistake' - different
connections and probably refilled on a line some distance from the
butane cylinders.

Your description does suggest that it's butane not propane - is it
possible that Calor themselves did not refill your cylinder? Where did
you get it?

It's not one of these 'new' regulator set-ups is it? What are the
symptoms when they begin to get gunged up?

I got it from a local caravan dealer. They only do Calor.


That's almost a politician's answer! It doesn't get to what I was
tentatively suggesting. The dealer may sell Calor cylinders containing
gas but does he get his filled cylinders from Calor? Is he an official
Calor distributor? Filling cylinders is not rocket science and the
dealer may have found a cheap source of filled Calor cylinders (even
done it himself) over which there is no quality control. That would
breach any contract that he may have with Calor, of course.

I had wondered about the regulator - it is one of the new fixed ones -
but
the caravan was just back from service where I expect the regulator
would have been checked.


I think it's more likely that you should follow up this possibility. A
lack of flow of vaporised propane as a result of a gunged up regulator
would, I suspect, have very similar symptoms to a reduced flow at low
temperatures of vaporised butane through a clean system.

I wouldn't 'expect' anything from a service! Unless specifically asked
they are unlikely to check for anything other than leaks: if that.

Try the following for light reading:

http://tinyurl.com/yjx57l3 (CC)

http://www.calor.co.uk/technical-bul...mendations.pdf
(I'm not convinced that having the inlet to the regulator at the top is
a good idea. I'm guessing that there is a recognition of existing
caravan or regulator design features in this recommendation i.e. making
the best of a bad job. The fourth link (Truma) seems to recognise this.)

http://www.nationalcaravan.co.uk/ima...kages_rev1.pdf
The third paragraph contains the information that may lead you to a
diagnosis. With the cylinder valve closed disconnect the inlet hose from
the regulator and look for any signs of oily dampness. It's possible
that if the regulator inlet valve has been affected adversely by the
'oil' that replacement may be required but additional measures should be
applied to prevent a recurrance.

http://tinyurl.com/yjd4atc (Truma)
This suggests a solution.

Another improvement may be to get rid of the rubber lined hose from the
cylinder to the regulator in an attempt to rid yourself of any problems
arising from deterioration of the rubber liner.
http://www.gaslow.co.uk/pages/c_s2_1.htm


As a follow-up to the last item, quite a lot of work has been done in
Western Australia where a similar problem to that affecting UK caravans
has been seen in automotive LPG installations. There is a fundamental
difference in that the caravan cylinder to regulator hose should be
carrying only gas whilst the hose considered in Western Australia carries
liquid LPG. There's a very nice report detailing the findings:
http://tinyurl.com/yhkzmkm
(I've given the top level link as some of the other documents are also
interesting.)


Thanks for that Dougal. Interesting reading and I'll check the hose next
time I'm at the caravan.
I'm still not convinced in that the van is a 2008 model with the regulator
mounted high as recommended.
Also the fact that heating the bottle removed the problem still suggests to
me that there may be a problem with the actual gas.


  #7 (permalink)  
Old October 20th 09, 07:46 AM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Andy R
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 821
Default calor propane


"KAW" wrote in message
...
Has anyone had problems with propane. Last Sun am when temp was about
+3degC
my propane wouldnt vaporise.

Propane boils at around -42C. Therefore, if the lpg you were looking at
wasn't boiling, it wasn't propane. End of story.

Had to go back to the old remedy of pouring hot
water over the cylinder (nearly new Cylinder). I wondered if calor had
refilled some cylinders with the wrong gas,

If you are correct and it wasn't boiling then it cannot be propane.
Depending on how far you want to take this you could wait until a frosty
night (0C or below), leave the cylinder out overnight and in the morning
open the gas tap on the top of the cylinder. If little or nothing comes out
then it aint propane and you can complain to the supplier and/or Calor. If
gas rushes out with no sign of abating then you prob lies elsewhere.

Rgds,

Andy R


 



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