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UK Caravanning (uk.rec.caravanning) A forum for the discussion of caravanning undertaken by residents of the United Kingdom, whether in the UK or abroad. It encourages the interchange of views on the merits of models of caravan, makes of tow car, accessories, caravan sites, caravan clubs, and other related topics. The term caravan is to include trailer vans, motor caravans and trailer tents.

Just a recap on the M5 ban



 
 
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old August 4th 04, 08:11 AM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Uno Hoo!
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 308
Default Just a recap on the M5 ban


"TP" wrote in message
...
"Mary Fisher" wrote:



And they have governors which limit their speed. Would that

caravan/trailer
owners did.



Why do you say that Mary? The speed limit of 60 mph on vehicles towing
trailers was set many, many years ago when vehicles and caravans were a lot
less stable, and had far worse brakes than they do now. Many would argue
that the 60 mph limit is unnecessarily low and increasing it to 70 mph would
reduce the anger felt by non-caravanning motorists when they are slowed down
by a car/caravan travelling at 60 mph overtaking a truck doing 59 mph. 60
mph is not a 'magic' figure that means 'travel at 60 and you're safe, travel
at 70 and you're dangerous'.
Wouldn't you agree?

Kev


Ads
  #2 (permalink)  
Old August 4th 04, 09:51 AM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Mary Fisher
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,847
Default Just a recap on the M5 ban


"Uno Hoo!" wrote in message
...

"TP" wrote in message
...
"Mary Fisher" wrote:



And they have governors which limit their speed. Would that

caravan/trailer
owners did.



Why do you say that Mary?


It would force towers to keep within the legal limits.

The speed limit of 60 mph on vehicles towing
trailers was set many, many years ago when vehicles and caravans were a

lot
less stable,


... and roads were far less busy ...

and had far worse brakes than they do now.


.... and cars weren't as powerful.

Many would argue
that the 60 mph limit is unnecessarily low


That's irrelevant. The law should be obeyed even if people don't like it.
Some might think that theft should be made legal, or rape, or ... well you
name your preference. I prefer to keep to laws and not think that I know
better than those who have good reason to define what should be done to
protect others.

and increasing it to 70 mph would
reduce the anger


If people feel anger whhile driving I suggest that they aren't fit to be
driving. Anger is not a desirable trait for drivers, it's an emotional loss
of control which could be extended to loss of control of the vehicle. Anger
is failure.

felt by non-caravanning motorists when they are slowed down
by a car/caravan travelling at 60 mph overtaking a truck doing 59 mph. 60
mph is not a 'magic' figure that means 'travel at 60 and you're safe,

travel
at 70 and you're dangerous'.


Wouldn't you agree?


No. Is 70mph a magic figure? Is 80? 90? 117?

There will always be vehicles on the road which for whatever reason hold up
other traffic. So what? Why does anyone need to drive fast?

Limits must be set, the limits should be obeyed whether we like them or not.

Wouldn't you agree?

Mary

Kev





  #3 (permalink)  
Old August 4th 04, 09:51 AM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Mary Fisher
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,847
Default Just a recap on the M5 ban


"Uno Hoo!" wrote in message
...

"TP" wrote in message
...
"Mary Fisher" wrote:



And they have governors which limit their speed. Would that

caravan/trailer
owners did.



Why do you say that Mary?


It would force towers to keep within the legal limits.

The speed limit of 60 mph on vehicles towing
trailers was set many, many years ago when vehicles and caravans were a

lot
less stable,


... and roads were far less busy ...

and had far worse brakes than they do now.


.... and cars weren't as powerful.

Many would argue
that the 60 mph limit is unnecessarily low


That's irrelevant. The law should be obeyed even if people don't like it.
Some might think that theft should be made legal, or rape, or ... well you
name your preference. I prefer to keep to laws and not think that I know
better than those who have good reason to define what should be done to
protect others.

and increasing it to 70 mph would
reduce the anger


If people feel anger whhile driving I suggest that they aren't fit to be
driving. Anger is not a desirable trait for drivers, it's an emotional loss
of control which could be extended to loss of control of the vehicle. Anger
is failure.

felt by non-caravanning motorists when they are slowed down
by a car/caravan travelling at 60 mph overtaking a truck doing 59 mph. 60
mph is not a 'magic' figure that means 'travel at 60 and you're safe,

travel
at 70 and you're dangerous'.


Wouldn't you agree?


No. Is 70mph a magic figure? Is 80? 90? 117?

There will always be vehicles on the road which for whatever reason hold up
other traffic. So what? Why does anyone need to drive fast?

Limits must be set, the limits should be obeyed whether we like them or not.

Wouldn't you agree?

Mary

Kev





  #4 (permalink)  
Old August 4th 04, 11:30 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Alex Heney
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 138
Default Just a recap on the M5 ban

On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 23:21:14 +0100, TP wrote:

Will Cove wrote:

And the reference to the actual figures to support your claim is? ...



The Transport Research Laboratory, Crowthorne (TRL).

Actually, in those days, it was called the Transport and Road Research
Laboratory (TRRL).

Have you heard of it?


Yes.

And the reference to these figures is?

  #5 (permalink)  
Old August 4th 04, 11:30 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Alex Heney
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 138
Default Just a recap on the M5 ban

On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 23:21:14 +0100, TP wrote:

Will Cove wrote:

And the reference to the actual figures to support your claim is? ...



The Transport Research Laboratory, Crowthorne (TRL).

Actually, in those days, it was called the Transport and Road Research
Laboratory (TRRL).

Have you heard of it?


Yes.

And the reference to these figures is?

  #6 (permalink)  
Old August 5th 04, 09:06 AM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Will Cove
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 85
Default Just a recap on the M5 ban

TP wrote in news:[email protected]
4ax.com:

And the reference to these figures is?


[snip]

http://www.trl.co.uk/1024/mainpage.asp



That will get you to the main TRL page but not to the figures. I think that
Alex may have been asking you to point him to the actual TRL reports, such
as http://www.trl.co.uk/1024/reports.asp?url=421.htm (The effects of
drivers' speed on the frequency of road accidents) and
http://www.trl.co.uk/1024/reports.asp?url=323.htm (A new system for
recording contributory factors in road accidents). However, those links
will only give very inadequate summaries and it'll cost you twenty-five
pounds each report to read the actual text.

Since you quote TRL as you primary source, can we assume that you've
actually paid for those reports? Perhaps you haven't actually read the
material on which you base your claims but have chosen instead to swallow
government spin hook, line, and sinker.
  #7 (permalink)  
Old August 5th 04, 09:06 AM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Will Cove
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 85
Default Just a recap on the M5 ban

TP wrote in news:[email protected]
4ax.com:

And the reference to these figures is?


[snip]

http://www.trl.co.uk/1024/mainpage.asp



That will get you to the main TRL page but not to the figures. I think that
Alex may have been asking you to point him to the actual TRL reports, such
as http://www.trl.co.uk/1024/reports.asp?url=421.htm (The effects of
drivers' speed on the frequency of road accidents) and
http://www.trl.co.uk/1024/reports.asp?url=323.htm (A new system for
recording contributory factors in road accidents). However, those links
will only give very inadequate summaries and it'll cost you twenty-five
pounds each report to read the actual text.

Since you quote TRL as you primary source, can we assume that you've
actually paid for those reports? Perhaps you haven't actually read the
material on which you base your claims but have chosen instead to swallow
government spin hook, line, and sinker.
  #8 (permalink)  
Old August 5th 04, 09:42 AM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
TP
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 207
Default Just a recap on the M5 ban

Will Cove wrote:

Since you quote TRL as you primary source, can we assume that you've
actually paid for those reports?



When I worked in consultancy, those reports were in my firm's library.


  #9 (permalink)  
Old August 5th 04, 09:42 AM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
TP
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 207
Default Just a recap on the M5 ban

Will Cove wrote:

Since you quote TRL as you primary source, can we assume that you've
actually paid for those reports?



When I worked in consultancy, those reports were in my firm's library.


  #10 (permalink)  
Old August 5th 04, 11:46 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
TP
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 207
Default Just a recap on the M5 ban

Alex Heney wrote:

TBHB, even if he is right about the accident rate increasing when the
limit was raised from 50 to 60/70, that is not very relevant to now.

Thirty years ago, cars were simply not able to cope nearly as well
with problems at high speed as they are now, and some problems were
more likely anyhow.



What a pathetic attempt at "explanation".

You really are a complete waste of space, so PLONK!!

Bye.

 



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