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UK Caravanning (uk.rec.caravanning) A forum for the discussion of caravanning undertaken by residents of the United Kingdom, whether in the UK or abroad. It encourages the interchange of views on the merits of models of caravan, makes of tow car, accessories, caravan sites, caravan clubs, and other related topics. The term caravan is to include trailer vans, motor caravans and trailer tents.

Highway Code----when its legal / illegal to U-turn



 
 
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old June 30th 05, 08:17 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Tox O'Grady
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 30
Default Highway Code----when its legal / illegal to U-turn

My poor mum & dad are being ferried home from Dumfries this eve after a road
accident this lunchtime. I'm still learning the details via my brother (
whos had to drive up and fetch them and their Trophy van as their Vectra is
a write-off )
Apparently my dad (68yrs) had set-off down the wrong road out of Dumfries
and spotted a stretch on the road where there were laybys either side. This
is where it went a bit Pete-Tong......he's pulled into the left layby to
maximise his turing circle and attempted to U-turn but didn't spot somebody
coming up at a rate of knots behind them. I figure this person has also
misread the situation an not slowed as they thought my dad was just pulling
in
Anyway major broadside crash and to make it worse there was a copper parked
near by who saw it and my old man got cautioned.
He's very upset and it could transpire that he calls it a day caravannning
as he has a heart condition ( not serious ) plus he's stressed about having
to re-apply for his license come his 70th birthday late next year. So my
recent checks into caravanning on this NG could come to fruition as I might
get a very cheap van offered to me soon. ( I will be encouraging him not to
make any knee-jerk reactions though )

I don't know for sure yet but I'm certain this would by a std single
carriageway A-road. I'm not for one minute trying to suggest my dad isn't at
fault for this accident, but what I'd like to establish is :-

1. Whether he SHOULD'NT of actually attempted to U-turn in the first place,
i.e. for example if there are signs which say "no-U-turn" , does this mean
that you can U-turn anywhere so long as there are NOT signs located
there......

2. If he was able to U-turn legally but simply made a mistake of not
spotting the approaching car behind him, then at worse could this just be
interpreted as driving without due care. After all we all are human and
these things happen. I didn't think that everybody who shunted the back of
another car in a motorway pileup was put up for a court appearance for
driving without due care...

3. Many many moons ago I got into a bit of trouble in Scotland and I certain
at the time the Law took pleasure in throwing the book at any English
subjects. If he does get hawled up to the Sherifs courts would he be wise
investing in a solicitor

4. If its clear he shouldn't have U-turned in that area, then I can
understand the chances are high he'll get booked, but otherwise I thought it
could be put down to a human error.





Ads
  #2 (permalink)  
Old June 30th 05, 09:03 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
David
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,622
Default Highway Code----when its legal / illegal to U-turn


"Tox O'Grady" wrote in message
...


2. If he was able to U-turn legally but simply made a mistake of not
spotting the approaching car behind him, then at worse could this just be
interpreted as driving without due care. After all we all are human and
these things happen. I didn't think that everybody who shunted the back of
another car in a motorway pileup was put up for a court appearance for
driving without due care...


I think it should be driving without due care, but as he was cautioned
wonder if the police officer might be going for dangerous driving.
I was the start of an incident last year in which the other parties involved
sadly did not tell the truth and it too started out as dangerous driveing
but because I stuck to the truth it was changed to driveing without due
care. The police decided not to take the matter to court if I went on a
police approved driveing course, at which I found no one person or factor is
to blame in a road traffic accident. In your fathers case the other driver
is equally to blame, he should have been driveing so that he could have
stopped.
The course was good for as the practical side of it got my confidence back,
in fact in a way you could say I enjoyed going on it.
I hope your father comes out of this OK and will soon be able to get behind
the wheel again.

--
Regards,
David

Please reply to News Group.


  #3 (permalink)  
Old June 30th 05, 09:03 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
David
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,622
Default Highway Code----when its legal / illegal to U-turn


"Tox O'Grady" wrote in message
...


2. If he was able to U-turn legally but simply made a mistake of not
spotting the approaching car behind him, then at worse could this just be
interpreted as driving without due care. After all we all are human and
these things happen. I didn't think that everybody who shunted the back of
another car in a motorway pileup was put up for a court appearance for
driving without due care...


I think it should be driving without due care, but as he was cautioned
wonder if the police officer might be going for dangerous driving.
I was the start of an incident last year in which the other parties involved
sadly did not tell the truth and it too started out as dangerous driveing
but because I stuck to the truth it was changed to driveing without due
care. The police decided not to take the matter to court if I went on a
police approved driveing course, at which I found no one person or factor is
to blame in a road traffic accident. In your fathers case the other driver
is equally to blame, he should have been driveing so that he could have
stopped.
The course was good for as the practical side of it got my confidence back,
in fact in a way you could say I enjoyed going on it.
I hope your father comes out of this OK and will soon be able to get behind
the wheel again.

--
Regards,
David

Please reply to News Group.


  #4 (permalink)  
Old June 30th 05, 09:22 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Nebulous
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 205
Default Highway Code----when its legal / illegal to U-turn


"Tox O'Grady" wrote in message
...

1. Whether he SHOULD'NT of actually attempted to U-turn in the first

place,
i.e. for example if there are signs which say "no-U-turn" , does this mean
that you can U-turn anywhere so long as there are NOT signs located
there......


Not an expert but unless it had clearway or no u-turn signs shoulds have
been okay.


2. If he was able to U-turn legally but simply made a mistake of not
spotting the approaching car behind him, then at worse could this just be
interpreted as driving without due care. After all we all are human and
these things happen. I didn't think that everybody who shunted the back of
another car in a motorway pileup was put up for a court appearance for
driving without due care...


Quite a common conviction in Scotland - 'driving without due care and
attention' otherwise known as careless driving. I have one myself - got a
30 fine and an endorsement 25 years ago.

3. Many many moons ago I got into a bit of trouble in Scotland and I

certain
at the time the Law took pleasure in throwing the book at any English
subjects. If he does get hawled up to the Sherifs courts would he be wise
investing in a solicitor


It depends- he should check out the potential penalties. Trying to turn a
car and caravan in the face of oncoming traffic may be viewed quite
seriously by some sherriffs. I pled guilty by letter and didn't have to
appear and wasn't represented. For older drivers- generally a fair bit older
than your father a short ban with the requirement to resit your driving test
at the end of it is not uncommon.

4. If its clear he shouldn't have U-turned in that area, then I can
understand the chances are high he'll get booked, but otherwise I thought

it
could be put down to a human error.


You're not allowed to make human errors that put people at risk without at
least potentially facing legal consequences.

Neb


  #5 (permalink)  
Old June 30th 05, 09:22 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Nebulous
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 205
Default Highway Code----when its legal / illegal to U-turn


"Tox O'Grady" wrote in message
...

1. Whether he SHOULD'NT of actually attempted to U-turn in the first

place,
i.e. for example if there are signs which say "no-U-turn" , does this mean
that you can U-turn anywhere so long as there are NOT signs located
there......


Not an expert but unless it had clearway or no u-turn signs shoulds have
been okay.


2. If he was able to U-turn legally but simply made a mistake of not
spotting the approaching car behind him, then at worse could this just be
interpreted as driving without due care. After all we all are human and
these things happen. I didn't think that everybody who shunted the back of
another car in a motorway pileup was put up for a court appearance for
driving without due care...


Quite a common conviction in Scotland - 'driving without due care and
attention' otherwise known as careless driving. I have one myself - got a
30 fine and an endorsement 25 years ago.

3. Many many moons ago I got into a bit of trouble in Scotland and I

certain
at the time the Law took pleasure in throwing the book at any English
subjects. If he does get hawled up to the Sherifs courts would he be wise
investing in a solicitor


It depends- he should check out the potential penalties. Trying to turn a
car and caravan in the face of oncoming traffic may be viewed quite
seriously by some sherriffs. I pled guilty by letter and didn't have to
appear and wasn't represented. For older drivers- generally a fair bit older
than your father a short ban with the requirement to resit your driving test
at the end of it is not uncommon.

4. If its clear he shouldn't have U-turned in that area, then I can
understand the chances are high he'll get booked, but otherwise I thought

it
could be put down to a human error.


You're not allowed to make human errors that put people at risk without at
least potentially facing legal consequences.

Neb


  #6 (permalink)  
Old June 30th 05, 09:53 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Tox O'Grady
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 30
Default Highway Code----when its legal / illegal to U-turn

It depends- he should check out the potential penalties. Trying to turn a
car and caravan in the face of oncoming traffic may be viewed quite
seriously by some sherriffs. I pled guilty by letter and didn't have to
appear and wasn't represented. For older drivers- generally a fair bit
older
than your father a short ban with the requirement to resit your driving
test
at the end of it is not uncommon.



By all accounts it was not 'oncoming' traffic.....that I would agree is
dangerous driving. I know for sure it was the drivers side that was hit,
therefore I am drawing the conclusion that it was a car 'behind' he failed
to spot and swung into its path.

I think if he gets anything more than 3-points and a fine for 'due-care' ,
such as resitting tests etc, then he may call it a day driving as his
confidence will be severely dented. Typical proud stubborn old bloke
I'm 36 and passed my test 1st time @17. I would not relish having to resit a
test again mainly because of all the theory stuff



  #7 (permalink)  
Old June 30th 05, 09:53 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Tox O'Grady
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 30
Default Highway Code----when its legal / illegal to U-turn

It depends- he should check out the potential penalties. Trying to turn a
car and caravan in the face of oncoming traffic may be viewed quite
seriously by some sherriffs. I pled guilty by letter and didn't have to
appear and wasn't represented. For older drivers- generally a fair bit
older
than your father a short ban with the requirement to resit your driving
test
at the end of it is not uncommon.



By all accounts it was not 'oncoming' traffic.....that I would agree is
dangerous driving. I know for sure it was the drivers side that was hit,
therefore I am drawing the conclusion that it was a car 'behind' he failed
to spot and swung into its path.

I think if he gets anything more than 3-points and a fine for 'due-care' ,
such as resitting tests etc, then he may call it a day driving as his
confidence will be severely dented. Typical proud stubborn old bloke
I'm 36 and passed my test 1st time @17. I would not relish having to resit a
test again mainly because of all the theory stuff



  #8 (permalink)  
Old July 1st 05, 08:59 AM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Christian McArdle
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 601
Default Highway Code----when its legal / illegal to U-turn

3. Many many moons ago I got into a bit of trouble in Scotland and I
certain
at the time the Law took pleasure in throwing the book at any English
subjects. If he does get hawled up to the Sherifs courts would he be wise
investing in a solicitor


He's already been cautioned, so it should be the end of the matter. The
caution counts as a type of conviction and punishment. The deal is that you
effectively plead guilty and get what amounts to an absolute discharge. I'm
no lawyer, and know even less about Scottish law, but I would be amazed if
they can reopen proceedings after a caution has been accepted.

Christian.


  #9 (permalink)  
Old July 1st 05, 08:59 AM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Christian McArdle
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 601
Default Highway Code----when its legal / illegal to U-turn

3. Many many moons ago I got into a bit of trouble in Scotland and I
certain
at the time the Law took pleasure in throwing the book at any English
subjects. If he does get hawled up to the Sherifs courts would he be wise
investing in a solicitor


He's already been cautioned, so it should be the end of the matter. The
caution counts as a type of conviction and punishment. The deal is that you
effectively plead guilty and get what amounts to an absolute discharge. I'm
no lawyer, and know even less about Scottish law, but I would be amazed if
they can reopen proceedings after a caution has been accepted.

Christian.


  #10 (permalink)  
Old July 1st 05, 11:31 PM posted to uk.rec.caravanning
Nebulous
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 205
Default Highway Code----when its legal / illegal to U-turn


"Christian McArdle" wrote in message
. net...
3. Many many moons ago I got into a bit of trouble in Scotland and I

certain
at the time the Law took pleasure in throwing the book at any English
subjects. If he does get hawled up to the Sherifs courts would he be

wise
investing in a solicitor


He's already been cautioned, so it should be the end of the matter. The
caution counts as a type of conviction and punishment. The deal is that

you
effectively plead guilty and get what amounts to an absolute discharge.

I'm
no lawyer, and know even less about Scottish law, but I would be amazed if
they can reopen proceedings after a caution has been accepted.


It depends what he means by being cautioned. I had assumed that he meant he
had been read his rights and told he would be referred to the procurator
fiscal- although now you put it like that it is possible he may have been
given a roadside caution. I'm not aware of that actually happening for road
traffic offences though. .

Neb


 



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